Another purpose

[aj]

*glances around the currently empty room, except for one really big desk* I think once this place gets decorated, it would make a pretty good place for authors on the make to pick up editors, don't you?

I'd like to invite any of the authors on the site to post a notice here when they're looking for an editor, a proofreader or beta reader(s). Likewise, if one of the editors on the site is feeling bored and underutilized (yeah, right!), a notice here might be a helpful step toward returning to the usual swamped state where most of us find ourselves.

On a personal note, I'm really interested in seeing how different members of our cadre would handle the same piece of writing, as editors. I've never seen someone else's process...only finished products. So, if someone would like to suggest a way that we could do that here, I'd be delighted. I have a few ideas, but I'd love to hear other's thoughts on this.

cheers!

aj

[Jamie]

Congrats on the post and good luck. Just remember you are still a citizen of Icaria and while you currently have a green card for the AD site you're only allowed out of the castle for a few hours a day!

Jamie

[TalonRider]

AJ, maybe we could get an author to write a short story just for editor's/proofreader's. Something to test our skills and then throw comments back at us as to how we did. It would also test me to see what I've learned in the process, being relative new at this. I have seen some constructive comments from some of the Collision Crew authors.

Currently, I working with Jamessavik on "Broken", The Collision Crew on "Collision," with quite a group of author's there, James, Graeme, Oz, crvboy, Codey, Ryan, Tragic Rabbit, Plasticreality, nmos, and Blue. I'm also working with a relative new author, Yaalc, and of course a veteran writer, Dewey as his BS editor on "TPW."

So it will be interesting to see what goes on here.

Jan

[TalonRider]

Don't worry, AJ. The crew lets me out from time to time.

[Graeme]

I'm happy to provide something, if you want to take up Talonrider's suggestion. I have a short story I wrote a couple of months ago that I haven't posted anywhere. It is not a gay story, but for this exercise, I don't think that will matter. It is three pages long.

[aj]

Wow, thanks Aussie! that would do just fine. Let me talk to Dude about space requirements and where he wants to post the whole thing, and I'll get back to you on how we'd like to do it.

Of course, I'd need to get some editors interested in doing this with me, so....anybody interested?

If you'd like to receive a copy of the short story from the incredibly brave Aussie and have a chance to tear it down and rebuild it , just let me know either here or in PM.

cheers!

aj

[TalonRider]

If I may make a suggestion AJ, for those of us who will participate in this exercise, the author would/should send the story to the editors. The editors do their thing and send it back. Once all works are back and the author grades them, so to speak, he would/should post the results for each of us. If by chance the editor was really, really bad, then email it to them.

Talon

[Graeme]

Just let me know what you want me to do

[The Mail Crew]

Hi,

This is Aaron. I'd like to take a stab at Graeme's little story. You all know that I've edited other things for Graeme, but I want you to know that I have not seen the story he offered.

I hope there's no big rush on this, since I'm taking a break from editing June 9-19, and I'm booked up from now until June 9.

I think Talon's suggestion is a good one. That would prevent any editor being influenced by the edits of another editor, which could unintentionally happen if edited results drifted in piece-meal to this forum.

Aaron

[Graeme]

Before we can start, I think a few things need to be sorted out.

AJ has indicated that he's interested in the process, not just the final result. To do that properly, we'd need to effectively track all (or at least most) communication between the author and the editor, including copies of the story.

We then need to present that in a way that shows what has occured. As a side point, I only see the final edits from Aaron. I'm aware that he goes through things more than once before he sends them back. Are you interested in those interim steps (which may be hard to track), or maybe just a comment about that part of the process?

This is just off the top of my head, so feel free to shoot me down...

1. The original story is posted.

2. A thread is created for each editor, which shows THEIR process and results.

3. All of this is done after the event, so it is only at the conclusion that all the details are posted. To make it fair on the editors, I'd recommend that THEY do the posting of all details.

Another concern (hopefully minor) is whether the feedback from multiple editors will influence the author in their responses back to each editor.

What do you all think?

Graeme

[Tanuki Racoon]

Wow, thanks Aussie! that would do just fine. Let me talk to Dude about space requirements and where he wants to post the whole thing, and I'll get back to you on how we'd like to do it.

I will gladly shred a three page story to bits. Actually, I'll do to it what I do to all my authors. It would be educational. And maybe my proofers would see what I'm looking for.

I rather like this idea.

Brutality as sport :)

(I'm kidding on the last comment. Really.)

-- wbms

[Tanuki Racoon]

I think the story should be sent out with, say, a one week time limit.

Then the results should be POSTED for all of us. Then we can see our different takes on the same piece.

Then, our esteemed victim (I mean AUTHOR), can do it again, and reply with whatever comments are appropriate, fixing technicalities, and we can then all try re-editing the adjusted one.

The best part is the editors can fight each other over who's right for which correction.

A sample if you will: Die asshole! That is plural subjective tense if I ever heard it. Eat lead, scumbag! Your participle is dangling again. Etc.

-- wbms, ever subtle as always.

[The Mail Crew]

As a side point, I only see the final edits from Aaron. I'm aware that he goes through things more than once before he sends them back. Are you interested in those interim steps (which may be hard to track), or maybe just a comment about that part of the process?

Graeme, I don't think even I could track those interim steps. That involves several trips through on the computer, doing the red, then a printout after each go, followed by the red-pen trick on the hard copy. My final (almost) step is what my buds here call my "mumbling stage" where I pace around with a copy, reading certain passages and trying them in different ways. :? THEN, you get the final file with all the red in it. :D

Aaron

[aj]

I don't think it would be practical to post ALL of the process involved...unless we wanted to post video clips of aaron mumbling, or me sweating and smoking like a chimney as I try to figure out the best way to handle a particular sentence/paragraph, etc. I think what we'll do is what has been suggested: send out the story to everybody with a one-week time limit on it. Have them work it over, and send the resulting draft to me. When I have 'em all, I'll post the original draft, and the resulting drafts WITH editing notes, and then talk about second drafts at that point. Does this meet with approval?

So far I have Aaron, WBMS, Talonrider and myself. Anybody else want to take a whack at it? Let me know. Since I want Aaron to participate, I'll set the deadline for returning the short story edited draft to me for a week after he's back from vacay, and Graeme can send out the story anytime he wants prior to that. Yes, that means most of us will have more time with the tale than Aaron will, but life is intrinsically unfair. Aaron, if you need more time wi' it, let me know and we'll fix it.

cheers!

aj

[The Mail Crew]

AJ, if Graeme sends out the story after we leave, I will get it at the beach house and read it, but I've promised the guys I WON'T do any editing of ANYTHING while we're on vacation. They would kill me.

Aaron

[Graeme]

As the desiginated victim... sorry, author... I have email addresses for Aaron, WBMS and Talonrider, but not AJ.

AJ, can you please send me an email or PM with the details?

Any other editors who want to be involved, please do the same.

Out of deference to Aaron's boyfriend, I won't send it out until Aaron's on vacation, as otherwise he might be tempted to take the printout with him....

That means other editors have at least a week to make a decision on whether they want to be involved.

Graeme

[Codey]

After you guys are through bashing...I mean editing Graemes story, I have one for you to show off your skills, that you've sharpened on Graeme, on. (how's that for dangling my participle?)

Codey

[TalonRider]

I think what we'll do is what has been suggested: send out the story to everybody with a one-week time limit on it. Have them work it over, and send the resulting draft to me. When I have 'em all, I'll post the original draft, and the resulting drafts WITH editing notes, and then talk about second drafts at that point. Does this meet with approval?  

aj

Sound good to me.

Talon

[Graeme]

G'day, Paul!

I'll start by saying that good editors are very much in demand, so I wish you all the best.

When I started writing (which wasn't that long ago), I found that mentoring on how to write was initially more useful than editoring. I was told about the worst mistakes in amateur writing... and then proceeded to break a couple of those rules (which I now regret... but I can't find the time to go back and fix them).

A good start would be to prepare the first page or two of what you're writing and then send it to someone for comment. With something that small, you could probably do it in a PM. I'd like to say I'd do some beta-reading for you (I don't consider myself to have anywhere close to the skills required to be an editor), but I'm finding less and less time to do that. However, if you would like to PM me a couple of pages, I'll let you know what I think. It's the least I can do after all the help I was given early on.

Graeme :)

[Tanuki Racoon]

I am a newbie writer in need of a good editor/proofreader/beta reader.

Is there anyone up to taking on another one of "those".

The first step is to probably say what type of story you're writing. Some people like to read coming-of-age stories, other people want high-school angst, and so forth.

And as Graeme says, there aren't many people out there who have the time. I do a few (Dabeagle and Driver) but like me neither one is writing. I'm just back after an extended absence, myself.

And, you're smart. A good editor is what you need. I am what is termed a "bad editor" -- I just tear up what I read. It's not to be mean, but if I like what I'm reading I want it to be as close to perfect as possible. I'm a red-ink sort of guy, I guess. Make sure you specify what you want, or make sure you've got thick skin.

Like Graeme, if you want to send me a page or two just for a quickie, I'll make some time to read it.