Doing Something - by Cole Parker

[JamesSavik]

I was thinking that a program common to Windoze/Mac would be an archival tool like a Zip/unZip program like 7zip:

http://www.7-zip.org/

He is correct because this is how a Trojan would get code into a target computer.

OK- enough geeky-ness:

I'm enjoying the story and looking forward to MOAR!

[FreeThinker]

Regarding the technical issues, I think everyone forgot that Troy's father's job was INTERNET SECURITY. If he wanted to put Adobe on his Mac, he would. If he wanted to add all the crap he wanted to it, he would. That was how Troy's father made his living. Let it go and enjoy one of the best stories I've read in a long time. Cole is one of the best wordsmiths around.

[Lugnutz]

This is fiction, yes? It's Coles tale and he tells it how he want's. Now back to the story.

I'll leave this here.

[blue]

Choices, choices.

I haven't forgotten I was going to comment. But I have an excuse. I've been writing! Yeah, maybe "my dog ate my homework" is more believable.

The Adobe PDF thing doesn't bother me. (1) Many Mac users still may have Acrobat Reader if they have any dang Adobe product. (2) Many users don't know jack about their computer, no matter what OS, and I'm not a guru, just slightly more advanced. (I miss my old Mac.) (3) The main story points, that it can be done and they chose to do so, is valid. Also, it doesn't stop governments or big businesses from doing it either.

There could be all sorts of moral arguments back and forth about the dad and friends doing that, etc., etc., and I could say I don't think it would be what I'd do if I were he, assuming I was a programmer or hacker, but then, I have not been someone who's had a family member abducted. If someone were to harm someone I love (that includes good friends) you can bet I would be (at least) raising the roof and rallying whatever attorney I could afford. In the case of this story, I know who my number one suspect would be, but I haven't seen enough to think something implicates that character.

Given that Troy's dad is a tech and having to monitor their email for safety, I'd be really surprised if he doesn't know Troy and Chase are close. However, unless Troy and Chase have been specific about some things, it's alos possible it could be interpreted as an open-minded, very close friendship. Straight friends and gay friends all talk about dating, relationships, sex, the more exotic stuff, whether it's something they'd want to do or not. How they talk about it does say something, but not every conversation about it means that two friends are actually doing whatever it is. A *fair* and loving and smart dad would see things like that and be careful about it before jumping to too many unfounded conclusions. But yes, this depends entirely on what Troy and Chase have said, plus what Troy's dad believes about any of that. I will say too, being smart and well educated does not always mean someone is accepting of things like being gay... or the idea their son and his best friend might be fooling around (or more serious about it). So, it would all depend on what Troy's dad believes and what Troy and Chase have written. Family and friends, in my experience, or heck, even the person him/herself, can miss clues that are right there, because they don't want to see them, either about themselves or someone else.

I think Troy is so close to his own situation (things with Chase and him) that he's primed to think everyone knows and thinks of it either in the ways he likes, or in the ways he has doubts about it. (Hmm...now who else does that sound like?)

Figuring out what's going on in people's heads can be complicated. Or it can be simple. You'll have noticed I over-analyze from too many sides at once. Call it an occupational hazard from training in both literary analysis and some programming courses.

Bottom line? Troy's dad and Chase's dad have not locked them in their rooms and made them wear chastity belts. Note also, whatever Charlie knows about Troy and Chase, he hasn't blabbed it to the neighborhood either. Until further plot complications, I'd say that's a good sign.

Very good story, much food for thought for me too. Kinda reminds me of someone. A few someones.

[blue]

I've just read Ch. 10 and I'm sure I'll have more to say. (How'd you guess?)

But for now, I'd like to say, this one hit home quite a bit. Some ways, I know why. Others, maybe it's whatever else is going on with me, but some I think is sort of rattling around, resonating with the story.

Anyway, thanks very much. This story is meaningful (and helpful) for me personally. But that aside, I think it's one of Cole's best. I still like "Courage" very much.

Both Troy and Chase make eminent sense to me. Though neither of them is quite like I was, they sure fit a few things.

Good job. Liking this novel immensely.

[FreeThinker]

Every time I read something of his, I tell him its the best he's ever done. But, it's because his work just continues to get better and better.

[Cole Parker]

You guy are really making me blush. Thank you, one and all.

C

[Lugnutz]

A great feelgood chapter. If you don't know what I mean, read it.

[Lugnutz]

Martinez is like a turd that won't flush.

[Chris James]

I love the way this story keeps us guessing. Teen romance angst, family in crisis, bad cops...what will Cole come up with next? Guess we will all have to stay tuned. Thanks, Cole, really enjoying myself with this one.

[Lugnutz]

My guess is Martinez will be in jail and Carly will be found before the end comes. Cole can be a bastard, but he don't kill charactors.

[blue]

I'm up through the latest chapter. I'm not sure Troy could get away with all that in the porch scene, but it was sure a hoot to read. This chapter and the last were both really neat. Good for Chase and Troy. Good for Lindsey and Trevor. Though I think LIndsey is probably sorting through her feelings, and Trevor...I think is full of curiosity, everything's new to him. I liked the glimpse we had of Charlie, hoping we'll learn more what he's like too.

Something's still up with Martinez, but aside from a bad attitude, I'm not quite prepared to say it's him. But yes, he's the one I suspect.

I'm not expecting Carly to return. After so long, cases like that generally don't have any happy ending. Just my opinion, plot-wise.

I've been saying I had some comments, and it's been so long, let's see if I can get down what I wanted to say.

[Lugnutz]

I have a theory on how this would end. I'll keep that to myself and see how the story goes.

[blue]

I have some thoughts on Troy and his Dad and on Chase, how they're each dealing with depression, but I'd rather tackle the other first.

Cole has done a really careful, sensitive job of portraying how Troy is trying to come to terms with his sexual feelings, his sexuality. Instead of massive angst or hiding things, he's initially decided he's gay and Chase is gay, and he's content with that. Then it would just be a matter of how that affects telling his dad or Chase's parents, or their friends. But instead, Cole's given us something not so simple. (If dealing with coming out could be called "simple.") Already at the start of the story, Troy and Chase are light-years ahead of where I was, growing up. But Cole has something more difficult in mind to handle.

Troy gets to know Lindsey and discovers, hey, what's going on? he has feelings for her, good feelings, it all seems to go right, and he is a smart enough guy to think that maybe it's because he's new to all this and he likes her, that maybe this is why he's responding, when he had thought he was gay. So he wonders if he's "really" gay. Or could he be bi? Or was it a phase, and he's "really" straight, except for with Chase?

And that gets at the heart of a lot of what it's like to be a real teenager, I think. Troy becomes aware he might be bisexual, or he might simply be riding all these hormones and everything is new and exciting. And he has to begin questioning how he really feels for Lindsey and Chase. He discovers there's more to sex and love than he'd thought, and although he's pretty clear-headed in recognizing his feelings and reasoning out what's going on with him, it's still something he has to come to terms with, to understand.

Those questions, sometimes unexpected or conflicting feelings, are (I think) what it's like for questioning teens. They probably expected to be straight, but surprise, they find they like the same sex, at least some of the time, in very physical and very emotional ways, and those are satisfying...but sometimes they may have feelings for the opposite sex too, and those may be satisfying. Is one more fulfilling than the other? Are both about the same? And just what the heck does a guy or girl make of all that, when he or she expected to like the opposite sex? Hmm. That doesn't even get into how other people, like friends, siblings, or parents might react to it. (Or, for that matter, whoever happens to be the boy or girl who the teen likes, if they haven't shared something together.) -- And I tend to think we all have some degree of bisexuality as the default, if we could see underneath all the rest. Many of us end up "primarily" or "exclusively" straight or gay, and many end up more in the "mostly bisexual" range, but in practice, it seems like we're all expected to be one or the other, when being bisexual might be the biological norm. That is, unless we're supposed to have the potential to be bi, but it's built-in for most to gravitate to "mostly straight" and some to gravitate to "mostly gay." I am basing that on those figures that around 5% to 10% are primarily gay, but around 33% supposedly have at least one same-sex experience of some kind in their lives. (Kinsey studies, and I think some later Dutch or Danish studies. Also UK census figures I'd seen a reference about.) With percentages like that (really, 1/3 of all people having a same-sex experience) and up to 10% primarily gay) would seem to say there's more potential there for overlap than we usually think -- including in the LGBT community.

Troy does some very astute searching through his feelings, and goes from thinking he's gay, to thinking he's bi, and talks with Lindsey and gets a surprise there, along with some free-floating curiosity from Trevor. Then Troy gets news of Chase, and has to think it all through again, and begins to understand the answer for his own case. Then we see what's going on with Chase, which is a big-time case of "I miss my best friend" and "I miss my boyfriend and serious crush and maybe life-partner." It really hits Chase hard. Then we get Troy beginning to put it together again, for himself and for Chase. Plus, we see Lindsey and Trevor dealing with their individual and different feelings.

I think Cole gives a convincing portrayal of how even someone who's primarily gay can have heterosexual feelings too, and how both homo- and hetero- feelings can be strong, good, and healthy. Troy comes to see he's gay, but he sees he could love Lindsey. In his case, he sees he wouldn't feel as complete loving Lindsey as he would Chase. But if he didn't have Chase, as often happens with other people, then he might have gone with Lindsey and been happy. If Troy were more toward bi or straight, he'd be even more happy with Lindsey. It just happens that for Troy, he's more toward the gay side of the scale, and he has Chase still.

We know at this point that Chase has been going through an awful time, feeling like he'd lost his best friend and his boyfriend (or even his partner). The separation throws Chase into a messy heap. Chase is lucky enough to have Troy, who won't turn away, and who actively gets him back in his life, so Chase and Troy can heal the damage in their relationship, the depression they've been in, and get back to good. Attaboy, Troy and Chase.

We don't know for sure at this point if Lindsey is gay or straight or bi. She's said some things, but she's thinking about it.

Trevor seems to be just discovering that, uh, he has one, and that other people have whatever, and that it all might be really great to investigate. He's very curious about Troy and Chase, the two new boys nearest him. He might be as curious if there were some girls nearby. Or he might be curious first about boys and then about girls. Or girls and then boys. Or.... Well, okay, let's just say Trevor's really starting to think about (feel) any of this. And hey, Troy and Chase look really good to him. They're the nearest chances for comparison with other boys, and that's pretty exciting too. -- No, I don't think Trevor's anywhere near figuring it all out yet. He's at the stage where he's just starting to feel those feelings and the main need then is to test and learn and compare. Troy, Chase, and Lindsey are old enough they're still in the middle of it, but they're beginning to feel their place in life when they'll be fully mature. They're starting to figure it out for themselves. The two ages are very different in physical, sexual, emotional, and social maturity. Trevor is going to be at the beginnings of those feelings where they first wake up and he wants to explore and find out things. But his feelings and his understanding are suited to his age. Troy, Chase, and Lindsey's feelings are suited to what teens in their age range feel, which is still not quite what they'll feel when they're past their teens. However, their feelings are a lot closer to that point, enough so it's a lot harder to differentiate. (I say that, thinking back to what I felt and what other kids I knew were going through, as far as I knew, at those ages.)

Before about 11, I was basically oblivious, but there was still curiosity and play going on. (And funny enough, my parents and grandparents knew about that in the bathtub, and it was no big deal.)

From 11 to about 14, that was when everything began to wake up, partly due to friends, but no, very little actual experience going on. Some was good. ("Hey, I really, really like that." -- Uh-huh, if you think you like it then, just wait until you hit puberty for real. -- "OMG, best. thing. ever. new favorite hobby!" :D ) Some was not so good. (Ouch, either physically or emotionally.) Some was just so-so, the normal lessons of crushes that go bust, but somehow, those were really significant for me. At 11 and at 14 would be my first very clear indications that yup, Ben is gay. (Yes, I heard Ben Gay jokes too.)

But my point in bringing that age range up is -- Every now and then, I also had a little interest in girls. The last time I had any fantasy involving a girl was in junior high. So I had the potential, or I was, bisexual to some degree, back then. Ooh, but I would not have admitted it, except maybe to my best friends. Maybe. -- Uh, I was way more likely to want to be with a guy friend. How to ask a girl out, how to tell if a girl (or a guy) liked me, those were mysteries I was not good at. I apparently wasn't too great at it with guys, either. -- So, decreasing interest in girls, but it was there. -- More telling was that first dream about my best friend...rudely interrupted by falling out of bed because I was so startled, including a very Freudian and disturbing dream image going on with that. Just my luck. That friend moved, or it's just possible I might've found out if he was as actively interested as I was. Ambiguous evidence, there.

High school, 14 to 18: I still was trying to figure out how to ask a girl or tell if she liked me. There were some nice girls too. But no real sparks. I think they all knew this; I didn't get a single "yes" to the few times I asked a girl out during high school. I still was trying to figure out how to ask a guy or tell if he liked me. But the idea of a "boyfriend" would not have occurred to me. I could defend other friends who were accused of being gay. I could do that very, very publicly. I could not admit I was gay. The thing was, despite pretty clear evidence, I wasn't sure I was. Oh, I like girls. Girls are nice, pretty, smart, funny, I like girls, I just must not have met the right girl. I must be a late bloomer. No real spark, though. Major sparks with two different friends, when I was 14 and 15, but like I said, didn't go anywhere.

If you've been paying attention, you'll have noticed this means my few actual experiences from my pre-teens through the end of high school were with guys about my age, and not much of those, and a lot of negatives going on, self-image and image reflected by others or general society as well as religious, school, and family life. But hey, there was enough good in there, and the hormones were very busy, that despite how confused and conflicted, questiong or in denial I was, yup, it was there. I think if I'd had more positive experiences, such as with either one of those crushes, (particularly them) that I would've come to terms with myself in high school.

My real intended point was to illustrate that even a primarily gay guy can have the potential for a straight relationship, a girlfriend.

My other point there would be how much a questioning or conflicted teen might be likely to be, during the same time period, both not quite clear on it all, how to go about finding out, as well as in denial internally about any clear evidence that he's not quite straight, or might be really gay. -- On the other hand (pun intended) if Crush #1 and I had gotten permission, well, I would've been very glad to find out if he wanted to do what I thought and hoped. And if Crush #2 had given any positive indications instead of how things turned out, well, daaaang, uh, okay, yes, I had it bad for Crush #2.

Say, I went off-topic somewhere in there.... Oh well, it was mostly a nice stroll down memory lane, straying off-topic.

Anyway, my intention was to say how well I think Cole has dealt with the whole topic of a teen discovering the complexity of his/her feelings and the potential there for bisexuality, before they can settle the issue of where along that scale they happen to fit.

I had intended to get into the idea that a person might be happy with a guy at one point in life and a girl at another point in life, and so on, which I think Cole has tackled here too.

[Lugnutz]

I didn't bother reading all that, it's just that posting guesses undermines the story. Any story. Guesses are good, just keep them to yourself and see how the story pans out.

[blue]

During the first few chapters of the story, I noticed how our hero, Troy, gets all worked up about his own feelings, and keeps writing these long, involved emails to Chase. Then he gets upset with Chase for not writing him back immediately with long, involved, deeply emotional emails (treatises!) back. Hmm.... Okay, that sounds strangely familiar somehow....

Unfortunately, Troy is so freaked out that it takes him ages to put himself in Chase's shoes and think that Chase is hurting too, only Chase may not be able to deal with it or express it like Troy does. Chase's personality is fundamentally different. We don't see how Chase is really affected until later, and the boom drops. ...Hmm.... Okay, that also sounds strangely familiar somehow....

(Note: I am somewhere in between Troy and Chase in personality, and a lot of their reactions in these first few chapters, well, very familiar territory. Not always flattering or comfortable to see the similarities, but I do recognize them. I wish I could be as clear-headed as Troy about my own emotional life. I deal a lot better with other people's stuff, or I think I do. Except, as noted, with very close friends or loves. I'm not the extrovert that Chase is, but Chase's and Troy's reactions while depressed, I recognize from experience.)

Troy and his mom and dad and later, Chase, all show signs of major depression going on.

The bit about boxes and things to do, and how that can all seem overwhelming, to the point that someone may avoid facing them, such as Chase's unread emails from Troy, rings true. There can be other quirks, like answering the door or the phone, ordinary chores, even things a person would always do habitually without fail, that can pile up, or else can get handled in certain cases and avoided in others, all happen with depression. (For example, I would meticulously do many things for my grandmother, but leave them untouched at home, even sometimes critical things.) (I'm not mentioning some other examples because I'm embarrassed about them, even though local friends have been over and they know.)

Troy's dad just sort of tunes out, as though he's experiencing everything from a distance or wrapped in something. Well, that's a good description: He's wrapped in the mess of pain, feelings, and confusion from what's happened, and he's so preoccupied with it, he's not paying attention to even necessary things, or to people he loves (like his son, Troy).

Troy's mom just has a complete nose-dive into the bottle and her personality completely changes, partly from drinking, but mostly because she can't/won't deal with the pain of loss. Troy's mom makes it even worse: She leaves, abandons them. Bad, bad, bad reaction. Not helping her. Not helping her husband and son, who still love and need her. -- I can actually understand the drinking, even though I haven't ever been into drugs and alcohol. But skipping out on her husband and son (or any good friend) I have problems with someone who'd do that.

That said, I'll have another comment in a minute.

Chase.... We later see when Chase is separated from Troy, Chase pretty much falls apart. He doesn't check his emails, to read or reply. He stops eating regularly or the usual amounts. (Or eating habits change.) His moods probably swing wildly. (We know he cusses at his dad at one point, unlike him.) He acts listless, lifeless, no interest in anything, not much reaction, even to whom and what he would love. His sleep patterns change, day/night cycle and insomnia or oversleeping. His interest in personal appearance and hygiene drops. He's probably not doing chores or homework like usual, either. He may not be doing favorite leisure activities like he would. Other things, he may or may not be doing. Some things might get into a loop, repetitive behavior. There might be some things he starts doing to compensate: Flurries of activity to make up for things. Unusual activities or things taken to extremes to compensate, or just to be doing something. Difficulty concentrating, even on things he's naturally good at. (Rereading because he can't concentrate, for instance; lack of retention or comprehension because he's so distracted or out of it.) He may do some things almost compulsively or repetitively to try to feel better. Sexual habits can change too. A tendency to think in black-and-white extremes, all-or-nothing, too; or to focus on the negative and fatalistic instead of the good and optimistic, especially if that would be unlike him.

That whole preceding paragraph is a list of warning signs of severe depression, and sometimes even suicidal behavior. It's a sign of serious trauma. -- Troy, his mom, his dad, and later, Chase, all show some of those. We find Chase shows most of them. That says how deeply being separated from Troy hurts him.

I can rattle off several of those signs from personal experience, or from experience with a few friends.

Oh, and that brings me to the item I'd skipped for later:

A person in severe stress, trauma, post-trauma, depression, or suicidal, may also become very "clingy" and need lots of reassurance; or they may become very standoffish and independent; or reclusive and hermit-like. They may refuse help even though they need it. (If so, a friend needs to know when/if to step in anyway.) They may push people away or keep their own distance, because (1) they don't want to hurt the people they love, and they think somehow being around them and their problems will hurt the ones they love, so they push them away to protect their loved ones from themselves or their problems; or (2) they may push people away to see if anyone either pushes back or stays around or hugs back, figuratively or literally. It's like an unconscious test. The person isn't aware that's what they're doing, though at times, they may be aware. In effect, they're testing: Do you really care about me enough to push back? Do you care enough to stick around, to stay with me and help or support me? Do you care enough to love me, even with all this? ...Or will you just leave like so many others who don't care?

Of course, there may be some flaws in that testing and acting out. But many people (supposedly friends and family) do not know how to handle it when a friend has problems, and so many of them simply quit calling, writing, visiting. Many will say they'll help, but when it comes down to it, they don't. Some outright leave, simply never show up again. I can assure you that happens, it's no exaggeration. So a person in duress may begin to test, to see if someone really is trustworthy. Never mind that acting out and testing like that can be extreme enough that it may have the very effect of causing people to leave.

That bit about pulling into your own shell or pushing people away -- I have done that. I've also had people gradually or very suddenly stop contact, often when I hadn't done anything, other times when I didn't think I had, but I had. -- This happens in crisis, either personal crisis or when dealing with someone else's crisis (such as family illness) and in depression.

Some of the venting and other things you've seen in my posts, some of which may seem odd, are either because I've been dealing with personal and caregiver depression, or because you, dear readers, have not been in those kinds of situations. (I'm still coming out of a period of 12 years of dealing with my parents' and then my grandmother's health problems, plus I'm handicapped, and until only a few years ago, I was closeted, so...there's stuff built up to work through.) ... Also, you may see things like that from other people who've been in various kinds of long-term stress, and you'll also see some unusual "coping behaviors" (or not-coping behaviors) from handicapped folks. And, for that matter, being LGBT can have some coping behaviors to deal with the stresses involved in not being accepted by segments of the larger culture.

If you'd seen the nose dive I did during college, becoming severely depressed, well, it was not pretty. I managed to flunk myself out of a good academic scholarship because (impending irony) I could no longer avoid admitting to myself that I was really and truly gay. I didn't try to talk to anyone on campus, either. I really, really should have. -- You don't have to party all the time to be awake all night and sleep most of the day, sometimes skipping class or meals. (I still managed to make A's in Calculus, Computer Science, except a D in Data Structures, English Lit, and French Lit courses. (Simplifying, there were multiple courses.) -- By comparison, when I went back for my associate's degree to community college, I made honor roll twice.

The lesson from that is: (1) Find someone with whom to talk about your problems. (2) If you're gay, it isn't worth flunking out of college or getting that depressed or suicidal. If you're in college, you're an adult, your parents can't tell you what to do, at least not while in college, and hey, there are other gay, lesbian, bi, and trans folks out there who'd really like a friend or a date, preferably both...and they might be interested in a little mutual biology too; beats doin' it alone. -- Oh, if only my college self would've listened. And if only my junior high and high school self had had some more positive experiences (including, yes, sex) to figure out it was really fine to be gay and not the only gay guy around. If the internet (and gay sites) had been around, it would've *really* helped. -- You'll notice I did eventually figure it out. Okay, still figuring it out. But I did come out, and yes, I read, write, and edit gay-friendly fiction and poetry.

That sort of thing is why I tend to get on my soapbox. It may weird people out or they may get tired of hearing it. But if there was one gay guy like me out there having trouble accepting himself, and yet really wanting it, then there are plenty more where that came from. Those guys need to see it'll all turn out okay.

In terms of the story -- When Chase arrives at Troy's, and Troy begins to shepherd him, to care for him, because Chase is so depressed -- That has happened over the course of only a few weeks, if that, within the story. So it's very sudden. Chase's behavior there is *very* at-risk, dangerously so. Troy handles it right. But if you see someone in that shape in real life, you *really need to help your friend,* because that friend is in real need and severely at risk. You have to gauge how to help without going overboard, scaring them, or making it worse. But do something to help, even if it's just a hug and a smile. (Trust me, a simple, heartfelt smile or hug can do wonders.) -- I would've expected Chase to be less obviously affected at that point, but it shows how much it's really shaken him.

Troy's solution is to be very careful and loving to his friend and to ease him out of it. That's good.

If a friend digs in his heels and resists or refuses help, then you do your best to get around that resistance. Love him, be caring, be genuine, and be damn persistent, and he'll at least know you're sincere. You'll help somehow. Remember that bit about a good smile and a good hug. (If he doesn't want a hug, there's a reason, but it may be that idea of pretecting himself or you.) Find some way to help and to get around the resistance to help.

I know this particular post has gotten into some darker and worrisome areas. But that's because one part of the story deals with those.

A main point of the rest of the story, the overall story, is that no matter how bad things get, you can still have friends, family, a boyfriend, who all love you and will be there for you. Another major point is, things get better. Life can be really good. There's a lot of life still to live, people to love and be loved by. There's good things in life, sunshine, enjoyment...skinny-dipping maybe...spending time with your boyfriend...spending time with the girl next door...more skinny-dipping...more time with that nice boyfriend....

Right, see, good stuff.

[blue]

I didn't bother reading all that, it's just that posting guesses undermines the story. Any story. Guesses are good, just keep them to yourself and see how the story pans out.

It was commentary, not trying to guess the plot. I have a few ideas where the plot's going, but mostly, I'm just along for the ride on that. I was trying to make some sense about what I liked in the story's approach.

[dude]

at 7:02 a.m. PST Luggie posted:

My guess is Martinez will be in jail and Carly will be found before the end comes.

then, six hours later after Blue's long and contemplative post Luggie posted again after admitting to not having read Ben's post:

I didn't bother reading all that, it's just that posting guesses undermines the story. Any story. Guesses are good, just keep them to yourself and see how the story pans out.

I'm gonna have to call somebody on House Rules:

1. Observe The Golden Rule

2. Use Common Sense

3. Be Considerate

4. Remember to use courtesy and good manners at all times.

No one knows everything -Play nice.

Mike

[Lugnutz]

My bad. I just contradicted myself. :(

[blue]

Well, considering that Luggie said he hadn't read what I'd written, and since Luggie's pretty much always a good lug, I kinda figured I should let it slide after my response. No real harm done. Thanks, guys.

[Lugnutz]

I think it's something I picked up from one of the off-road forums I'm on. When someone puts a long post up, someone would do the "TL;DR" (Too long, didn't read) bit and once in a while will get flamed for it because the post had good info in it.

I did just read Blue's post and once I boiled it down, it makes sense. Or dumb it down in my case.

Now, back to the story.

[Merkin]

Perhaps the use of the term SPOILER AHEAD would help in these situations.

[vwl]

Maybe SPOILER THROUGH SPECULATION would be more appropriate.

[Cole Parker]

You know, it's hard. It's very complimentary to a writer that his stories make readers eager to discuss what they're feeling, to talk about the characters and what they think might happen next. But it's also detrimental. Other readers see thoughts they themselses may not have considered, thoughts that can be distracting and don't usually have any follow through in the actual story. It's annoying to a writer who's spent a lot of time figuring out a plot and then mounting it in a format to sell the story in the best way he can; people suggesting where the story is going, if they do hit on what the writer has decided, will obviously detract from the emotions the writer wants his readers to feel from his denouement.

So I can see both side of this. I feel very honored that people want to discuss the characters, and the plot. But I also wish they'd keep their predictions of where the story is going to themselves. After all, in any whodunit, there's a lot more to a story than just identifying the villian. And it seems if that's all someone it trying to guess, there will be a lot of nuance missed.

Most of the comments here have been about what happened in the latest chapter, or earlier. That's great. Looking back and discussing what has occurred adds to the story and readers' interest in it.

I also think it's great if people want to speculate on their own; that's human nature. But personally, I wish they do just that: do it on their own.

My opinion, of course. What do the rest of you writers think?

C

[Lugnutz]

I'm going to leave it be. Anytime lately when I open my mouth, I end up stuffing my foot in it.