Chris James Posted March 13, 2013 Report Share Posted March 13, 2013 Boy Scout Survey: If you read through the survey as I did you will not be suprised at the negativity of the questions. When questions are asked this way the reader is led to believe that the whole purpose of gay scouts or gay leaders is to prey on the other boys who are supposed to be straight. http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/13/17297889-can-a-gay-boy-scout-share-a-tent-with-another-boy-boy-scouts-survey-members-on-anti-gay-policy?lite&ocid=msnhp&pos=1 About what I expected from the current Christianist scout leadership. I say there should be gay friendly troops with all the privledges of government and business sponsors. The others should be church troops who need to be supported by their religious organizations and damned for their bigotry. Link to comment
Richard Norway Posted March 14, 2013 Report Share Posted March 14, 2013 I don't often post here, as I should, but this topic has held my interest for a long time. I was a boy scout in youth and the things that they taught me were worth more than any religious organization has ever done, I don't want to see the boy scouts go away. But, they need to change, and I think they will, eventually. The marriage equality act is going before the Supreme Court this Spring. The country is beginning to accept that we exist as normal people, a part of their society. I want change now, but I'm realistic enough to know that it will take a little more time. Ladies and gentleman, we are at such as turning point in our country right now that our dreams will come true. Have patience, but know the realities and keep fighting. Link to comment
Merkin Posted March 14, 2013 Report Share Posted March 14, 2013 ...I was a boy scout in youth and the things that they taught me were worth more than any religious organization has ever done, I don't want to see the boy scouts go away. I'll second that sentiment, Richard. I treasure my time as a scout, and carry with me the skills I learned and the friendships I formed. But I do want to see the current leadership go away, as well as what have become the organization's repressive ties to church-based sponsorships. Years ago the innocent search for a hall to meet in on the local level ended up in church basements all too often, and every denomination seems to have quickly grasped at this opportunity to intrude and control. Breaking this relationship apart seems to me to be the only way to restore scouting to its original premise. Link to comment
The Pecman Posted March 15, 2013 Report Share Posted March 15, 2013 Breaking this relationship apart seems to me to be the only way to restore scouting to its original premise. Note that the World Organization of Scouting, the organization that recognizes individual countries' own Scouting groups, says the following: On religion, WOSM states the following about its Fundamental Principles: Under the title "Duty to God", the first of the above-mentioned principles of the Scout Movement is defined as "adherence to spiritual principles, loyalty to the religion that expresses them and acceptance of the duties resulting therefrom". It should be noted that, by contrast to the title, the body of the text does not use the word "God", in order to make it clear that the clause also covers religions which are non-monotheistic, such as Hinduism, or those which do not recognize a personal God, such as Buddhism. It says nothing on homosexuals. So this is something the Boy Scouts of America chose to add. I haven't been able to determine if the UK Scouting organization has the same rules or not. Link to comment
E.J. Posted March 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 scout oath in U.K. On My Honour, I promise that I will do my best, To do my Duty to God and to the Queen, To help other people at all times, And obey the Scout Law. scout law U.K. A Scout is honourable, truthful and reliable. A Scout is loyal to the Queen, his/her Country, his/her Parents, his/her Officers and to comrades high and low. A Scout is helpful to others, whatever it may cost him/her. A Scout is a friend to all and a brother/sister to all Scouts. A Scout is courteous to all. A Scout is kind to animals. A Scout is obedient and follows orders from his/her Parents and Officers promptly. A Scout is cheerful and takes trouble with a trusting grace. A Scout is self reliant and a good steward of his/her possessions. A Scout is upright in his/her conduct. scout oath in U.S. On my honor I will do my best To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law; To help other people at all times; To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake, and morally straight. scout law U.S. A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent. Link to comment
Cole Parker Posted March 16, 2013 Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 Interesting that there are so many things one has to be all at once. What do you think it takes before they realize they can't possibly live up to all facets of the scout law all the time? Ten minutes? Five? C Link to comment
Merkin Posted March 16, 2013 Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 8. A Scout is cheerful and takes trouble with a trusting grace. I can usually handle Britspeak with the aid of a good dictionary, but this one is beyond my understanding. Anyone? Link to comment
Cole Parker Posted March 16, 2013 Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 I had to read that twice, too. I assume it means the scout has a postive and friendly disposition and when he encounters troubles, he maintains his outlook and demeanor and expects that the problem will be solved with a minimum of fuss and feathers. C Link to comment
Steven Adamson Posted March 16, 2013 Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 I had trouble understanding that line too, but only because i misread it as 'makes trouble with a trusting grace.' Link to comment
Merkin Posted March 16, 2013 Report Share Posted March 16, 2013 I'm still stuck on this one. It is more convincing to me to read it such that the scout should take the trouble (i.e. make the effort) to be cheerful by means of a trusting and graceful disposition. Could that be it? Do eleven year-old British boys understand this kind of sentence? If they do, they are way ahead of our Yank kids. Link to comment
Jeff Ellis Posted March 17, 2013 Report Share Posted March 17, 2013 A Scout is cheerful and takes trouble with a trusting grace. A Welsh interpretation. " A Scout is cheerful and trustingly accepts adversity gracefully." "takes" in this case I read as equivalent to "takes it on the chin" gracefully, trusting that it will all come out right in the end Link to comment
Steven Adamson Posted March 17, 2013 Report Share Posted March 17, 2013 I'm still stuck on this one. It is more convincing to me to read it such that the scout should take the trouble (i.e. make the effort) to be cheerful by means of a trusting and graceful disposition. Could that be it? It's basically the very British idea that one should "Keep calm and carry on" when things get rough. Link to comment
Merkin Posted March 17, 2013 Report Share Posted March 17, 2013 Thanks, guys, those are reasonable explanations. I'll have to assume this part of your scout rule set makes sense to thousands of British boys (although the idea of 'calm' and 'boy' in combination is a real stretch). Link to comment
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