Maine Measure Would Wipe Out LGBT Protections

[E.J.]

Maine Measure Would Wipe Out LGBT Protections

by 365Gay.com Newscenter Staff

STORY LINK

(Augusta, Maine) A conservative Christian group is mounting a referendum effort that could wipe out all protections for LGBT citizens in Maine.

The proposal would ban same-sex marriage and civil unions, wipe out existing laws giving limited rights to gay and lesbian couples, removed LGBT protections under the state's Human Rights Act, and would remove funding from the Attorney General's Office to investigate discrimination claims.

If it were approved by voters it would make the only New England state to afford no civil rights to its LGBT citizens. Same-sex marriage is legal in Massachusetts while civil unions are available in Vermont, New Hampshire and Connecticut. Some protections are afforded same-sex couples in Rhode Island.

The Christian Civic League of Maine says if it doesn't act now the courts or the legislature could allow same-sex couples to marry.

"The only real question remaining is whether same-sex marriage will eventually be allowed under the law," the groups executive direction, Michael Heath told the Bangor Daily News.

"We?ve decided to put our own views out there on this and start the debate."

The proposed referendum must be approved by the Secretary of State?s Office. If it is accepted, the group must collect about 55,000 signatures to have it put on the ballot.

In 2005 Heath's organization attempted to roll back gay rights protections in the Maine Human Rights Act through a similar referendum. The debate was acrimonious and voters eventually rejected the bid.

Maine's largest LGBT rights group vowed an all out campaign to defeat the referendum if it makes it to the ballot.

"The question that he has submitted to the secretary of state is so broad that it?s ridiculous," Betsy Smith, executive director of Equality Maine told The Daily News.

"I don?t even know if it?s legal to put a question like that on the ballot. He basically wants to repeal any rights gays have gotten."

?365Gay.com 2008

[Trab]

I have to wonder if putting in a similar referendum with the exact same referendum wording, but picking some other minority group as the target, would show how absolutely stupid this is. Just duplicate the wording exactly, but substitute blacks, jews, aboriginals, etc. Wouldn't that show them up for verging on the insane? Just a thought.

[colinian]

These people aren't Christians. They are hate mongers.

A similar attempt has been made in California three times, and the perpetrators failed to gather enough signatures every time. There's been noise about trying again, but limiting the effort to striking down domestic partnerships because they cost the state money, and any couple (read: heterosexual) can be married so domestic partnerships aren't needed. Like I say, so far it's only been talk. I think they're waiting for the ruling of the California Supreme Court on gay marriage, due in about 60 days.

Colin

[DesDownunder]

I have to wonder if putting in a similar referendum with the exact same referendum wording, but picking some other minority group as the target, would show how absolutely stupid this is. Just duplicate the wording exactly, but substitute blacks, jews, aboriginals, etc. Wouldn't that show them up for verging on the insane? Just a thought.

The obvious group to choose Trab, would be "The Christian Civic League of Maine".

Who know, it might even get passed into law?

I wonder where are our modern playwrights, screenwriters when they are missing out on writing a truly great play or film parallelling "The Inquisition", Witch-hunts and persecutions and assassinations of people purely on the basis of fear and superstition?

Why do we not see stories about this oppression of basic human rights?

There appears to me to be astounding resources for stories based on the right to believe versus the right to be.

Maybe we have lost the gift to transpose such concepts into worthy art forms of discussion as enlightening and thought-provoking entertainment.

[JamesSavik]

This is why I so pessimistic when it comes to gay rights. Every time we gain the smallest concession, even when they are the wrong ones, it's never over. The other side tries to roll it back.

[Fun Tails]

James, James... They *try* to roll back our rights. Their success rate is near zero. Cause for optimism right there. Look at this long term. YOung people have very little anti-gay sentiment compared to older folk. When the 'old fuks' die out as one of my good friend likes to put it, society will become more accepting.

"The only real question remaining is whether same-sex marriage will eventually be allowed under the law," the groups executive direction, Michael Heath told the Bangor Daily News.

"We’ve decided to put our own views out there on this and start the debate."

I'd have to say he's suceeded. His views are certainly out there.

[DesDownunder]

As an old hippie, I was rather hoping for doing away with marriage altogether and just let people love each other on a continuous basis of free love.

Still I have no objection to people being in a committed relationship so long as it is what they want.

The worst outcome would be for people to feel obligated to marry just to meet social pressures to conform in order to be acceptable.

I guess the Hippie agenda is worse than the Gay one in some peoples minds.

[Trab]

I think the most serious side issue of free love is that anyone who won't commit to a marriage is probably not going to commit to raising children. We should allow free love, but only amongst the 'unfertile', which would include any gay couples.

[DesDownunder]

I think the most serious side issue of free love is that anyone who won't commit to a marriage is probably not going to commit to raising children. We should allow free love, but only amongst the 'unfertile', which would include any gay couples.

The Hippie communes were very successful at raising children within a loving atmosphere of communal parenting.

Such communal parenting would have had to have been practised to some degree during mankind's historical evolution, or we would have hardly survived.

Marriage in my family and many others I have come across, did not for one moment stop one of the parents from not supporting the children.

I also know a few couples who detested the thought of marriage as a social institution and have in fact now been together since the sixties, watching their children grow and become parents. Most of the children and grandchildren have married whilst their grandparents thought it was all good. They are still devoted to each other but won't marry.

Social insistence on marriage, can be argued to be an infringement on the individual's human rights.

Society at large should not be able to condemn people for their choice of adult consenting relationships.

What society may do however, is limit its support of such relationships if they are not formally registered in some way.

[Tragic Rabbit]

YOung people have very little anti-gay sentiment compared to older folk.

Then why are phrases like 'that's so gay' and 'faggot' heard non-stop in high school hallways?

[JamesSavik]

Here in the states, I think that we've got things ass-backwards. Many gay activists seem to think that gay rights = gay marriage and that's just not the case. There are a number of much more remedial civil rights issues that were they addressed, would help a lot more people quicker than simply having the right to marry.

Specifically I mean anti-discrimination protections in jobs and housing plus enforcement of the equal protection under the law (14th amendment).

I think that we need to start with the basics and frame it as a civil rights matter. Better to have the cake than wish for the icing.

[Fun Tails]

Then why are phrases like 'that's so gay' and 'faggot' heard non-stop in high school hallways?

Cuz I never said they were TOTALLY accepting.

Also, I think we've had discussions before in this board about how even gay supporting people and gay people themselves, use the word gay to mean lame rather than a homosexual insult. I mean, I have friends who actively try to set me up on dates etc, who use the expression. I'm not saying I don't have a problem with that use, just that it's not necessarily indicative of a large problem.

[Cole Parker]

Then why are phrases like 'that's so gay' and 'faggot' heard non-stop in high school hallways?

Because it's the insult de jour. You know better than I do that kids copy other kids. Monkey see, monkey do. That's what they say to each other to put each other down these days, and it has little or nothing to do with actually being gay. I was trying to counsel a kid a couple of years ago and he kept telling me he was being called that, and it took me much more time than it should have to realize he wasn't complaining that his sexuality was being questioned, or that the other kids were actually doing that; he was simply being insulted.

I hope your school has an anti-discrimination policy that's supported by the administration and enforced. I know there are schools in Texas that have gone that route. In most schools where such policies are in place, improvements have been dramatic.

C

[colinian]

Here in the states, I think that we've got things ass-backwards. Many gay activists seem to think that gay rights = gay marriage and that's just not the case. There are a number of much more remedial civil rights issues that were they addressed, would help a lot more people quicker than simply having the right to marry.

Specifically I mean anti-discrimination protections in jobs and housing plus enforcement of the equal protection under the law (14th amendment).

I think that we need to start with the basics and frame it as a civil rights matter. Better to have the cake than wish for the icing.

You're right. Doug and I are registered domestic partners in California. That grants us almost all the rights of heterosexual couples (no marriage or divorce), certainly all of the important ones. Neither Doug nor I feel we have to have a marriage ceremony to show our commitment to each other. I know a lot of other gay and lesbian couples feel strongly about the marriage issue, but we don't; maybe it's because we're young -- we're still just 18 years old. Whatever, we have what we need right now.

Including having to do our California income tax as Married Filing Jointly. TurboTax was just updated to make that work, and I've been struggling with it this evening up until about a half hour ago. And I'm not done. Doug and I have a lot os stocks in our brokerage accounts, and all of those trades are so freakin' complicated to figure out because Schwab and E*Trade and Morgon Stanley don't provide a summary with the basis (purchase price and date), just the sales date and price. What a freakin' PITA! I'm so exhausted I had to do a little surfing before bed, and then I have to finish doing the taxes and submit them tomorrow. Bother!!!

Colin

[colinian]

Sorry, I just get a duplicate post without any effort by me.

Colin

[Nickolas James]

Then why are phrases like 'that's so gay' and 'faggot' heard non-stop in high school hallways?

I have to say that I hear the word faggot out in public about 100 times more often than at school. As far as the phrase "that's so gay" goes, I admit to being just as guilty as anyone else. I also call a lot of my friends "gaylord." It's not that big of a deal to me, and I'm out, so people pretty much know I don't mean it in a homophobic way.

I think the bigger problem is the way we accept gay jokes being cracked on TV shows like Letterman and Leno, or even on South Park.

[DesDownunder]

You're right. Doug and I are registered domestic partners in California. That grants us almost all the rights of heterosexual couples (no marriage or divorce), certainly all of the important ones. Neither Doug nor I feel we have to have a marriage ceremony to show our commitment to each other. I know a lot of other gay and lesbian couples feel strongly about the marriage issue, but we don't; maybe it's because we're young -- we're still just 18 years old. Whatever, we have what we need right now.

Colin

My partner and I, feel the same way as you and Doug, Colin, and we are no longer teenagers.

Sorry, I just get a duplicate post without any effort by me.

Colin

Same thing used to happen to me when I was 18.

[Drewbie]

Like a few others on here, I do say that's so gay as well, or me and a friend say yea he's really faggy or a fag. Doesn't mean I hate other gays, word fag doesn't bother me. and if some jock said it, there been a idiot , know it doesn't make sense.

wasn't to long ago, when I was in middle school, heard from others as well, I know like, when kids say don't be a faggot, is saying don't be a weak person, nothing to do with gays, it seems every word has many reasons, granted I don't say certain words with people unless they would get what im saying, still some will take a word a wrong way.

[colinian]

Sorry, I just get a duplicate post without any effort by me.

Colin

Same thing used to happen to me when I was 18.

Do you mean that I won't get any more duplicate posts once I'm older? When -- how old? Do they just stop immediately, or do they sort of fade away? Or maybe they become less and less frequent? Both Doug and I want to know.

Colin

[The Pecman]

The Hippie communes were very successful at raising children within a loving atmosphere of communal parenting.

I don't agree. I know several communes in the U.S. in the late 1960s/early 1970s that were total disasters, filled with drugged-out morons and malnourished, uneducated children, living in squalor -- basically rural slums set up to grow large pot farms. There were several 60 Minutes stories that aired on CBS News during the 1970s, and I remember vivid portraits of how bad some of these groups were. Many (if not most) disintegrated and eventually gave up and returned to the cities.

There was a lot of disillusionment about the 1960s, once people began to realize that the idealized concept of communes, peace and love just didn't happen as everybody hoped.

Maybe it was different down under, but that's the way it was in America.

I do agree with the general point that well-balanced, normal kids can be raised by atypical parents, including same-sex partners, single parents, or even a group of people -- under the right circumstances, and with enough money, love and care.